tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post5631323312386885139..comments2023-05-01T04:51:15.777-07:00Comments on Gladsome Lights: Architecture of War and HistoryGretchenJoannahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13641677400029070452noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-24448982340967806802010-08-26T13:01:29.053-07:002010-08-26T13:01:29.053-07:00I truly missed out on a fun discussion here by com...I truly missed out on a fun discussion here by commenting first and not returning! The ideas and wisdom expressed are inspiring.<br /><br />I wonder if architecture is a bit like literature. No one pretends to really know NOW, which current literature will last, will be "classic" and universal, will be representative of its age. We find that out later -- 50 years from now, when today's authors and readers are all dead.<br /><br />Will this museum, the Louvre pyramid, the new World Trade Center and others be appreciated later as monuments of insight? What do we want a building to be? Do the architects express themselves, or try to please the public? We freely admit that good stories speak to our human bones; there are timeless themes and struggles. Perhaps architecture is the same, and architects should look for ways to incorporate the timeless. To be forever seeking to invent something new and shocking, is a sure way to fail. <br /><br />God is orderly, and man in his sin falls naturally into chaos. We need no reminders of this. In striving for order, for beauty, for timelessness, we reach for God and eternity, and we engage in an inner war against our own chaos. Like you, I doubt some modern architects consider these theological truths.M.K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09205619221345704689noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-62473832829521307212010-08-25T10:44:26.390-07:002010-08-25T10:44:26.390-07:00How did I miss seeing this post? I am glad you wr...How did I miss seeing this post? I am glad you wrote part 2 with a link back. I am also appreciative of the wonderful readers you have gathered who have written here. <br /><br /> When I think about the deconstuction of histories that we seem to be constantly faced with it is understandable that some architects and others want to "hardwire" messages in the story of a place with buildings. But such a delicate dance it is to tell the truth of tragic failure, arch active sin and haunting sorrow of the past without mis-shaping a new morning. Hope does not happen in a happy vacuum, redemption itself waits on the conviction of the need...<br />How art or architecture will effect any one soul can't be determined. Whether statements and impact can weather the generational shifts is also a question, or whether even in individual lives a "desired" impact will be sustained.<br /><br /> Mankind is so often building, overtly or covertly, monuments to self, towers of Babel... perhaps what we teach each other in the buildings, do for one another in the bulidings needs to be a more central focus. <br />I don't have any answers ( but the One ) and am just contemplating outloud amongst you others who I find very tender and thoughtful and so I thank you, dear Gretchen and your readers.Jeannettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06115410908800997558noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-84947339623231874472010-08-01T08:26:55.552-07:002010-08-01T08:26:55.552-07:00I was interested in reading this post because I wa...I was interested in reading this post because I was born in Germany and my maternal grandfather was actually from Dresden. However, I know very little about him, as he died before I was born. My relatives did not talk about the war years..too many painful memories. I had one uncle who was a German POW and kept a scrapbook of his imprisonment. He had high regards for his American captors.<br />Your article has certainly sparked my interest in this fascinating subject and tragic era.<br />Thank You,<br />AnitaAnitahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03205461146035913939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-11453294940449978552010-07-28T04:19:06.968-07:002010-07-28T04:19:06.968-07:00What an insightful and powerful post this is! And ...What an insightful and powerful post this is! And I love the discussion here in your comments section. It really reminds me of how hard it has been for me to ever enjoy my German heritage. My father was born in Germany, and even though his family immigrated to Michigan when he was a small boy before World War I, I have always felt guilty for being half-German. I have to jump all the way back to the Brothers Grimm and the old fairytales to find myself, and oh my! those fairytales were pretty grim, too. I hope we can find a way to heal the past without forgetting, and to go forward in peace, love, harmony. The Holocaust brings us face to face with forgiveness and with how to forgive in the face of the unforgivable. I don't have the answers myself, but I love how you jump right in to such great issues with so much thoughtfulness and with such a deeply caring heart. xo KariKari of Writing Up A Stormhttp://www.writingupastorm.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-23004380423549917462010-07-27T21:58:28.320-07:002010-07-27T21:58:28.320-07:00Hi again, GretchenJoanna! I think your last statem...Hi again, GretchenJoanna! I think your last statement nails it on the head - these particular innovations don't seem to have that undergirding of the Gospels, unless I'm missing something.<br /><br />And since architecture is a public art, I agree with de Botton - it is a kindness to be a little boring, although beautiful architecture certainly doesn't have to be boring. <br /><br />I agree with your comment about museums, too - coincidentally, this summer we went to the Marine Corps Museum in Quantico, VA, which has a very similar slanted pyramid design which is supposed to recall the photo of marines raising the flag at Iwo Jima. (and a statue is right in front of the museum so that reference isn't missed). But in the case of the MCM, the glass pyramid doesn't interrupt another building like Libeskind's design, since it's located outside the city and rises above the treeline and catches the sunshine. So a very similar design in a different context has a completely different effect. <br /><br />Likewise, I couldn't help thinking of another glass pyramid, the one designed by IM Pei as an additional entrance to the Louvre. I don't know the philosophy behind it, but it just strikes me as out of context and so a little silly, like a non sequitur comment. Maybe there is some reason for it's being, but it was lost on me, your average tourist. <br /><br />Now I'm inspired to look up more museums for comparison - and to read more about Dresden. Thanks!Emily J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/01132106976424535611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-85586287404524524132010-07-27T16:27:26.535-07:002010-07-27T16:27:26.535-07:00Very interesting! If you were to rebuild Dresden ...Very interesting! If you were to rebuild Dresden and not look back, but forward, how would you go about it? I agree that "onward and forward" is the best, but would there not be little bits of the past that one would want to honor, I wonder? (not the ugly, of course)<br /><br />JodyGumbo Lilyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02747138637571716591noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-9199402660126085642010-07-27T07:34:46.050-07:002010-07-27T07:34:46.050-07:00Emily, I am glad you went on at "such length&...Emily, I am glad you went on at "such length" and articulately presented a more educated viewpoint. I can't appreciate the designs themselves, and I doubt that my one architecture teacher, De Botton in his *Architecture of Happiness,* would either, because as I wrote in my post about that book, his first principle was:<br /><br />1) Order. But not over-simplified. We like to see complex elements arranged in a regular pattern.<br />What the author calls the “perverse dogma” from the Romantic Period, that all edifices must be of original design, led to chaos in the landscape. “Architecture should have the confidence and the kindness to be a little boring.” <br /><br />I was wondering if perhaps a museum might get away with such a brash statement, where being made to think isn't a bad thing, but you are probably right, the statement will lose its effect. (I hope in the meantime it squelches those Neo-Nazis a bit)...and yes, the jarring buildings fail to offer hope or show harmony. But without reference to or undergirding by the Christian gospel, an artist is unlikely to find those elements, and will drift from melancholy right on to nihilism.GretchenJoannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13641677400029070452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-62932821861709302572010-07-27T05:30:17.934-07:002010-07-27T05:30:17.934-07:00I came back to apologize for being long winded and...I came back to apologize for being long winded and contentious in the comments. And I want to say thanks for taking the time to write up this thought-provoking post. It has me thinking about many issues!Emily J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/01132106976424535611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-6054597836959760032010-07-26T22:32:55.162-07:002010-07-26T22:32:55.162-07:00This is interesting; I can see why you spent time ...This is interesting; I can see why you spent time researching!<br /><br />But I have a quibble: my husband's training and subsequent lecturing to me about the merits of classical architecture has made me suspicious of postmodernists like Libeskind who want to make their patrons uncomfortable and to force them to think. Granted, trying to recreate the past too precisely sometimes results in a sentimental/themepark like effect. But, on the other hand, for how many years can you exist in/with a building that is a criticism of the human person? At some point, I would think, the discomfort will fade and the intended self-conscious effect won't take place. <br /><br />Wouldn't it be more healing to build structures that promote healing, rather than criticism? Couldn't you say that the old building doesn't represent a severe authoritarian past, so much as an orderly past, a past that preceded the Nazis by centuries, and an attempt to restore order is an act of hope? Whereas the architect who intends to break self-delusions promotes a discomfort with the self that leads not to hope but to melancholy?<br /><br />Sorry to go on at such length! I am not opposed to innovations in architecture, but sometimes I wonder if some contemporary architects try too hard to be startling, instead of trying to come up with designs that suggest harmony. Maybe I'm too soft to appreciate these designs.Emily J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/01132106976424535611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-51248747767228499172010-07-26T07:51:48.537-07:002010-07-26T07:51:48.537-07:00Kurt Vonnegut's novel Slaughterhouse-5 is abou...Kurt Vonnegut's novel Slaughterhouse-5 is about the bombing of Dresden; it made a profound impact on me when I read it many, many years ago. So interesting to read about Daniel Libeskind's thoughts on the city's architecture and rebuilding. <br /><br />I grew up some in Germany and have traveled there as an adult. I'll always remember Freiburg, which was heavily bombed during WWII. When they rebuilt it, they used the original, medieval plans, so that it was exactly the same as before. I thought that was fascinating.<br /><br />francesLeft-Handed Housewifehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15014518128739580267noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7512869338404805014.post-79011454336963139712010-07-26T06:48:08.301-07:002010-07-26T06:48:08.301-07:00What an interesting and thought-provoking post! Th...What an interesting and thought-provoking post! Thanks, GJ! Another book tangential to this subject that might interest you is called, "My Life with the Great Pianists."It's by Franz Mohr, who traveled with Horowitz and tuned his performance piano for him. (What a fabulous job!!) Anyway, this man was from Dresden, and was in the city on that fateful day. His 1st hand account of his survival is riveting. I met him about 10 years ago in Iowa, when he came to speak at our boarding school. He is a wonderful Christian man, and his life is exciting to read about.M.K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09205619221345704689noreply@blogger.com